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Transcript 211D
The Physical Versus the Spiritual Aims of Mankind
HC: Good evening . Welcome to Open Forum.
CALLER: I wanted to ask you about election. I was studying something about this in a study, and I wanted to get your opinion on some things. First of all, the scripture is given in I Corinthians 15:46, that says, "That was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural and afterward that which is spiritual," which might indicate that the spiritual is to be over the natural. And it says that this law runs through the entire Word of God, in picture or type, when you look at people like Cain and Abel, Ishmael and Isaac, Manasseh and Ephraim, and Esau and Jacob. In other words, there was one there representing the earthly man and fleshly pursuits, and there was another that was concerned about God. And I wondered what you thought about that.
HC: In other words, your question really is, Does the Bible consistently show through this fact that there is that which is of the flesh, that which is physical and that which is spiritual? And you of course are correct. These are the two lines that run all through the Bible.
The line of Cain was totally related to this earth. He built the first city. He got his security and his hope out of this earth. The line of Abel was that of a shepherd. He was a stranger and a pilgrim here and served as a pastor, caring for the sheep, a figure of every born again believer.
We see the same thing in Abraham. His brother Haram built the city, but Abraham again was a shepherd, a stranger and a pilgrim. We see it in Jacob and Esau also, the physical over against the spiritual.
We even see it today, you know. There are many Christians who are just terribly concerned about this earth. That's all they ever talk about, what this earth is going to be. And they fail to realize that salvation has to do with something that is tremendously spiritual. It is related to Christ. It transcends this earth. It is far more glorious than anything this earth could ever produce.
CALLER: That's true. Some people are so concerned about the environment these days, about the earth.
HC: Yes. The same picture is there, that there are those who are beginning to think that it's the ultimate crime to destroy anything of this environment, because this is Mother Nature, whom they serve. And they fail to realize that this earth is not the bountiful Mother Nature, but that it is wearing out. It will not produce continuously for all of man's needs. And when it has worn out, then God will return. God has a prescribed program for that.
CALLER: You were talking about Cain. That interests me. So he did build a city. I think that reference says that they were the ones that dwelt in tents, and they made the instruments of iron, and things. Right? In other words, it was an industrial sort of thing.
HC: It's very significant, when you read Genesis 4, that all of the artisans, all of the industry, came from the line of Cain. They were the forgers in iron and bronze. Cain built the first city, they invented musical instruments. And when you study the line of Abel, you find nothing of this. He was a shepherd. That's all that you read. You go all the way to Noah, and you don't find that they built anything at all.
And you can see why this is. The world is deeply concerned about making this its place of security. And so it's deeply concerned about bigger and better cities, and all of the things that have to do with this life, because that's as far as they can see.
But the believer, the Bible teaches, is a stranger and a pilgrim here. It really is unimportant what kind of a house we live in. It's really unimportant what kind of a car we drive, it is unimportant how much money we have in the bank, or if we have any money in the bank. None of these things are important, because we're just passing through. We have a task now to be an ambassador of Christ, to live to His glory here in sharing the Word. But once that task is done, our destiny is to be with Christ forever. And first it's to be in our spirit with the Lord Jesus Christ in Heaven, and eternally it's to be in the New Heaven and the New Earth with Christ. We have a spiritual kingdom that is just as real as this earth, as real as any physical kingdom, but it is infinitely more glorious.
CALLER: Going along with this thing about the two natures, this study also talked about Esau and Jacob again, saying that the word hunter was used to describe Esau, but that Jacob was a very quiet man, dwelling in tents. Then it says that the word hunter is used of two men in the Old Testament. It's used of Nimrod, who was the founder of Babel, and Esau, from whom the Edomites descended. And it's significant that Babylon and Edom are mentioned in Isaiah and Revelation as an abomination to the Lord. In fact, He's utterly disgusted with them, especially since Babylon is the figure of sin, as you say. Right?
HC: Yes. Well, now you can see how the hunter figures. The hunter goes out, by his strength and by his ability, his stealth, his superiority, to hunt game, to find that which will provide for his needs. He is the master of his fate, the captain of his soul, so to speak. And that's a figure of unsaved man.
But the born again believer gets his food from God, like the Israelites receiving the manna from Heaven. They did not receive it because of their ability, or the fact that they were worthy in any way. They received it totally as a gift from God. And this is where we feed spiritually. Everything that we have spiritually is a gift of God. It is not anything at all that we have achieved for ourself.
CALLER: You've certainly shed some light on that. Thank you for spending time with me.
HC: Thank you for calling. Good night.