Subject: Messageboard Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 13:57:37 +1000 From: Mark Longmuir To: longmuir@labyrinth.net.au Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) --------------------------------------------------------------------- [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Hoist on their own...? Monday, 16-Aug-1999 23:23:34 130.194.11.89 writes: Another subject to think about (and add/respond to, of course!). I sometimes get the feeling that there a few contestants on the show who don't get to show their true talents because they are always being given the thing that they are deemed to be 'good' at. They demonstrate (or are known to have) a talent in one area, and are rarely given a chance to do anything but that. There was quite an argument a while ago involving discussion about Sandi Toksvig, and how she was always being relegated to the 'host' role in different games, never being given the quirks etc. to do (okay, that wasn't the subject of debate, but it was the starting point). From the sounds of it Denny Siegal was put into a similar role in her first try. But there are more pressing examples than this. For instance: Niall Ashdown - always being given accents to do. Rory Bremner - almost every episode he's in has game rules, quirks, and credit readings adjusted to get him to do impressions of famous people. Wayne Brady - okay, he's on regularly enough that he has to be given variety now, but he did get given a lot of singing to do (James Brown as a quirk, etc). John Sessions - in his later episodes, he was always given a variation on 'snobby/smarmish git' as quirks. Russell Fletcher - he's an Aussie, so in his one episode we had numerous references to Sheep Shearing and Neighbours. In fact, he didn't get much else to talk about! There are other variations on this - for instance, limiting some contestants mostly to the groups they work well in (Stiles & Mochrie, Meskimen & Smith, Sweeney & Steen, singing Lawrence & McShane), or contriving just some particular games/quirks to certain contestants ("Two Characters" for Meskimen & Smith), or even just selecting certain contestants who are almost always relegated to the hosting role in games (Proops, Sherwood, Slattery, Toksvig, Merton, ...). Okay, so these are often the things they do best, and they do produce some great moments. But is it too limiting? Would/does the show benefit from a bit of mixing up and variety? Do we want to see the contestants doing what they do best, or is it just as funny when they fail? Are there any other examples of contestants who are limited, or times when they've been given a chance to try something different and done it well? Am I rambling? Any thoughts? Mark ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Re: Hoist on their own...? Monday, 16-Aug-1999 23:57:37 205.200.28.46 writes: I think (and I'm likely in the majority) that the show could do with some mixing up. When I watch someone do something that I already know they can pull off beautifully, I get very very bored (PLEASE tell me they're running out of black singers for Wayne!!!). Something like Colin's hoedowns, I'm on the edge of my seat. And I'm starting to see outlines of Colin and Ryan infront of my eyes. In television land, however, there's a mental block that causes producers to do what works and stick with it. I'm hoping that once the audience gets more comfortable with the show (getting to know the games and contestants better), the US version will start showing games with flaws. I think as people who are more educated about improv than the average WL viewer, we recognize it a lot more when the actors are made to play on their strengths. I'm sure the random 42 year-old postal worker in Iowa isn't sitting on the couch in his boxers munching a bag of Doritos mumbling "it would certainly be interesting to witness how the dynamic of Scene to Rap would change if Ryan and Brad were to start it off" between bites. We're probably the only ones who talk about this, and thus I don't have high hopes for any huge changes. Sharilyn ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? IMHO..... Tuesday, 17-Aug-1999 02:35:07 202.49.46.7 writes: They So need some variation! I am getting so sick of singing people like Wayne not hardly ever getting anything else to do apart from singing (usually), then the singing games are going to start getting a little dull, cause we know exactly what to expect. It would be great to see someone like Ryan or Denny doing the singing, and Wayne doing a straight man's role (not all the time, just sometimes!) and Proops and Sherwood doing actual games instead of hosting all the time ect, I would especially love to see Greg doing a party quirk or something likke that where he can have the chance to fully show off his talent (he's the man! Or at least one of them). It would be great to do stuff like that, It would certainly spice things up a bit! Jenna ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... Tuesday, 17-Aug-1999 10:36:49 195.92.194.80 writes: The problem herein, I believe, involves the willingness of the contestants to take part in games which they are not at their strongest when performing. Clearly, games like Hoedown which all four have to perform are excepted, and each competitor knows they will have to do one at some point, though that doesn't stop people like Colin looking horrified and scared when the game is announced. Over the years, of course, he has become famous for either spectacularly doing the funniest verse on the Hoedown (exams, sex, space travel) but equally for mucking it up completely and pulling a Colin to get the laugh. But that doesn't mean he'd rather not do the Hoedowns at all, as he knows his limits, and 50 per cent of the time will make an absolute pig's ear of his verse and will resort to his coronary or blackout to secure the laugh while also saving his own skin. The improvisers do this show and other smiliar ones to make their living. This means they want to be good at it. I'm sure that the programme makers check their various strengths and try to allocate games which attribute to those strengths in order for the participants to bring in the biggest potential for slick scenes, clever ideas and laughs aplenty. Competitors won't want to do games which they struggle on, as it would make them look bacd for anyone who is looking for new talent for a project. They have to sell themselves in the best way, and that means performing in the games in which they can show off their skills. If, for example, Ryan were to be asked to do Song Styles, he could probably get away with it and be funny, but his record on mucking up Marches and Hoedowns in the past (particularly Marches) would always put that nagging doubt in the back of minds that he would fail when asked to make up a song about an alarm clock in the style of Bavarian church music. These people get on the show because of their consummate skill at improvising and their consequent entertainment value. That entertainment value, therefore, has to be of the highest calibre at all times in order to pull in the viewing figures. A fanatical Whoser like you or I can see the laughs in someone making a hash of a game, but the casual watcher will simply think "he's crap" and switch channels. In any profession, you work to your strengths. To use a sporting analogy, a central defender isn't employed to score 20 goals a season because he doesn't have the prowess, positional sense or the instinct in the opposition penalty area to do so. His job is to prevent goals being scored. He may get three or four per season from set-pieces, but that's it. Colin is a central defender, employed to make people laugh through wit rather than rhyme, though he may get three or four precious rhyming moments per season in which he succeeds, hence gems like the aforementioned Hoedowns. That all said, it's true that sometimes contestants seem to have been treated unfairly over the years, with the debate about Sandi's minimalist roles certainly grabbing people's attention. I think the problem for Sandi was that the producers often looked at the four competitors and decided for themselves, rightly or wrongly, which three had the biggest potential for coming up with funny, accurate, intriguing quirks and decided that "the other three", whomever they were, had that potential and therefore Sandi should be the hostess. She performed with Tony and Mike a hell of a lot - Greg too, though to a slightly lesser extent - and Mike's outstanding imagination and intellect coupled with Tony's insistence on saucing up proceedings made them obvious candidates. Remember also that Sandi was disturbingly good at guessing the quirks quickly, and when you only have 27 minutes to fill, that is an advantage as you don;t want games to drag on, to leave editors with the option of removing one of the most popular games on the show altogether or keeping it and playing a game less during the final broadcast. Sandi would have been a great guest, but I think politics and etiquette got in the way of fairness. As for competitors regularly appearing in the same pairs, this is an argument which I feel coincides with playing the same games. Ryan and Colin will ALWAYS make laughs together. They are a perfect pairing. They know each other's habits and comic minds and adjust themselves accordingly to make the improvisation believable and funny at the same time. That is a rare gift and shouldn;t be knocked in the name of variety. Unlike us Whosers, casual viewers will start tuning in more regularly if they know that these two in particular are appearing. Christopher and Jim also know each other well but are comparative strangers to the show and therefore their fleeting appearances will have been tailored so they could perform together regularly. It is their strength. It has to be about the strength of the competitors. Whosers apart, I claim yet again that casual observers will not find spoiled sketches funny, but will simply think that someone who can't perform a certain game because the scene or the circumstances are not right for them is merely a restricted improviser. Stephen Frost has a problem with this. He is a fine comic, with arguably the best specific timing of all the competitors when the situation is right, but he is often caught out of his depth and saves himself through his own laughter. I still maintain that Ryan doesn't rate him, but Stephen has spent the last few series performing solely with Americans and while he has done a more than adequate job, his performances alongside fellow Brits in the past (Tony, Jim and Steve) were much better. He was more comfortable in his surroundings because he was on the same wavelength. Had they got his long-time performing partner on the show, Mark Arden, there would have been carnage with the laughs. Those two are insatiable and have been for many years. Viewers of The Young Ones have seen this to an extent, while anyone lucky enough to see Saturday Live and Friday Night Live with Ben Elton in the late 80s will know this better than anyone. Sadly, Stephen's performing partner has never been on, so he has not had the Meskimen/Smith Sweeney/Steen comfort which others have had. Colin and Ryan had never been performing partners as such before WLiiA? but they have known each other for 20 years and it shows. Stephen has grappled with Ryan and Colin for some time now and while he copes with Colin (mainly because Colin's smiles seem to encourage him more) he struggles alongside Ryan, who is (literally and metaphorically) head and shoulders above him. The only time Steve really shines when in the company of Americans is in Old Job, New Job so if he can shine at that game, then why not let him play it each week? Notice that in games like Party Quirks and Press Conference, in both of which he plays the host, he struggles to guess the quirks or the person he is. I contend that had he been the host with Jim, Steve and Tony as his guests, or the famed person with Jim, Steve and Tony as the journalists, he would have succeeded more, not because they would make his job easier, just because he would not appear out of his depth with them. Rory Bremner is an impressionist, a comic art which goes one further than basic stand-up as he can actually charm an audience with an extra skill and still make them roll in the aisles. It is his strength and gives him immaculate comic timing, as anyone who has seen his own shows will back up. It therefore makes sense that he should be given the sort of games which allow him to use his extraordinary vocal range, though doing Roger Moore on two separate film dubs was perhaps going too far. Impressions, if good, will always create laughs, and that's what WLiiA? is about - creating laughs. Rory has that extra spice of having the comic capabilities as well as the voice range and it would be brave or stupid to force him into games where he uses his normal voice all the time. I'm sure he would be good, but the need for audience figures overpowers the risk element of forcing Rory into games where he is not playing a famous person who he knows he can satirise in any situation. It is repetitive but makes sense. In the UK, Rory is our foremost mimic, the best there has ever been, and has earned a very comfortable living through doing so. I doubt he would agree to come on the show unless games were tailored to suit his particular, unique skill. I must admit I can't recall many games, barring the famous credit reading, where Niall Ashdown has had to use his range of accents. Niall is an actor first and foremost, and actors need a range of accents in their repertoire in order to play varying parts. It's natural to them. The essence of WLiiA? is to be entertaining, and if we didn;t think it was we wouldn't be using this MB now. But it also needs audiences to continue. It needs to be a success. Hat-Trick need Channel 4 and its foreigh counterparts to agree to a recommissioning. It's an improvisation show, therefore you have to show the best improvisation by the best improvisers, and therefore that means using the participants to the best of their ability. When things go wrong, sure it's funny, but the masses who maybe watch the show casually may not think that. They see someone messing up, someone who they believe shouldn't be messing up as they're being paid well to be witty, quick, sharp, intelligent and wise. If they are shown not to be, then that creates a doubt about the quality and authenticity of the show, and the viewing figures may slip as a result. This means that the competitors must play games which suit their skills, so we won't ever see Ryan do Song Styles, don't expect Colin to sing in Greatest Hits, if you have a known pairing like Meskimen/Smith, expect them to perform together, and if you have an impressionist on the show, expect them to mimic a few voices. They want to make us laugh in the way they know how - it earns them a living. After all, it's not as if they're bad at it! Matt ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) Tuesday, 17-Aug-1999 18:44:54 151.198.133.235 writes: Also: It is known that we, the Whosers, the Biggest Fans of the show, would like to see some change because we've been watching since we got the 1988 episodes on tape and think the show's taken to falling into a bit of pattern lately (Ryan and Colin, Wayne's singing). However, there are millions of other Americans who watch the show whenever they can, but don't have any chat groups or message boards or conventions about it. They are the Casual Viewers, those who watch WL just to watch the show and get a laugh. The Casual Viewers are not keeping track of how many times Colin and Ryan have been paired up or other "constants" of DL. They don't seem to care if the show is the same every week, as long as it's a good show (because it is.) And I speak for most people who have posted under this thread when I say it would be nice to have some change in the show's pairings, but American TV is all about finding the "Winning Formula." The reason DL is so successful is that the show's producers have found that "Winning Formula" that keeps people tuned in every week. Change would be good, but since WL has a lot of viewers who think it a humorous show (me included), and are watching and laughing every week, the producers are obviously doing something right. In conclusion, although we Whosers would like it, it is not advisable in the world of American TV to toy with a formula that is already pulling in so many viewers. Thanks for reading :-) Evan aka Brem ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Playing Devil's Advocate... :) Tuesday, 17-Aug-1999 20:42:35 130.194.11.93 writes: Okay, well I pretty much agree with this, but in the name of keeping the arguments going :) The main thing I was thinking about in the original post (though it sort of got buried) was cases like Russell Fletcher, where his one chance to really impress was half-buried under a sort of "British view of Aussies" involving the sheep shearing references, Aussie soaps, etc. (then again, he did bring up shearing in the hoedown himself...). Niall probably didn't have as much limitation, also having more chance to show his stuff as well as being given some great singing opportunities. With the accents, I was thinking of the credit reading and one or two other memorable games of his ("Aieeee, you'll be looking for Nessie then!"). I can't recall how specific the suggestion was (it just came from the F&TS scene, didn't it?) but I have a feeling that he was often given a sort of 'world tour' of styles. I can't disagree that many of the great moments in the show have been those where things have worked out well, because the contestants have been playing on their strengths. But sometimes (e.g. Colin's Hoedowns), their strength can lie in that they can't do it, but instead can be more funny about trying not to/screwing it up. I'm not sure it's so much a case of the contestants not wanting to look bad - for a start, they should be reasonably confident that they're making a mostly good impression from the show. They can also be reasonably sure that WL (or other improv) will keep them busy for a while at least, and that they probably wouldn't be asked to perform in the areas they're not so good at anyway. (e.g. Ryan can be quite a singer on occasion, but I don't really see him being, or even wanting to be, employed as one). It's not something we should be aiming to show all the time, but from the sounds of it the US episodes have gone too far towards the safety side, at least while getting established. Hopefully now they'll start to mix things up a bit. It's good to have a working formula for a show, but assuming that such a formula will keep the show going in the long term probably won't work - without abandoning it completely, it still needs to be adapted to keep things fresh. Even for the casual viewer it can't be too long before they think "Oh no, not another black singer impression by Wayne... can't he do anything else?" (or something along those lines). I think the UK got the balance right, where most episodes were playing on the strengths (with some attempts at mixing it up), then the compilations which were a good mix of the 'best' games, plus some hilarious bits that didn't turn out so well (or the way expected). Saying "Old Knob New Knob", or Josie losing it in the fishing rap, or Mike kissing Tony, or insults between Clive and Sandi, aren't going to damage their reputations irreparably. (Well, unless someone starts some vicious rumours about Mike!) Rory Bremner probably wasn't a good example, because his strength does lie so much in his great impressions. It just felt a little annoying, though, to see his episodes reduced almost to a series of impressions, and to find that the games were being changed to suit him. Anyway, more later. :) Mark ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Just a little bit of advocation more... Wednesday, 18-Aug-1999 01:11:56 152.174.208.185 writes: Anyway, where was I... (got kicked off the uni computers before I could finish before!) Ah, Rory. Yeah, it just irked me a bit when they suddenly added in things, like "Rory, you can play such and such a game, this is your role... oh, and you're doing it as such-and-such" (in addition to the quirk, or where there usually isn't one). Steve Frost is a weird case. He's not necessarily the best to start off hoedowns - he tends to not know where he's going an collapse in a heap. Though once or twice, he's come up with an absolutely brilliant starting verse. I think he probably did work better with the UK contestants, Old Job New Job to me seemed like something that Ryan was usually better suited to (well, when Steve did it, I felt like it was taking the opporunity away from Ryan). Mark Arden might have been interesting, I've seen the Young Ones bits which are pretty good (and weird!). "Still, it's a laugh, innit?" "What is?" "That sound you make in the back of your throat when you hear something funny." Anyway, I guess I should sum up now... basically I think that, though WL might look more slick if they never screw up and always stay with a formula, pretty soon even a new audience will get bored with it. I seem to recall some newbies have posted (here or in the newsgroup) things along the lines of "I love the show, but do they have to always do the same thing every week?". It's not a case of making the contestants look bad by forcing them to do things they can't, but rather by giving them the chance to try out things and hopefully be enjoyable whether they succeed or not. Actually, it was more about the ones who never got such a chance, but it's developed from there!). Showing a few bloopers at the end of the series, or laughing at their mess-ups instead of just enjoying their successes, might make for a more variety-full and entertaining show. Regularly there are moments in the UK show that are hilarious _because_ they are messed up, or get out of hand. "Instrumental!" "You've turned into Richard Burton!" "Oh, f*** off!" etc. Maybe some US contestants aren't as good at being funny in failure ("Dance Break!" just didn't have the same effect). Whereas, in terms of moments that were great because they were done so well, only a few really stand out (e.g. the Beached Whale song - skilful singing but not that funny). I guess it's a case of at least giving them a chance to try different things (which, if completely unsuccesful and unfunny, can be left on the cutting room floor), and ensuring that contestants don't get 'pigeon-holed' into always fulfilling the same role in the show. Mark ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... Wednesday, 18-Aug-1999 12:10:30 195.92.194.46 writes: It is a sad fact that all in aspects of the media, the watchword is "safe". Often changes in formula, be they gradual or instant, can evoke emotions in the consumer where the comfort blanket associated with how something looks or sounds has suddenly been ripped away and they don't feel they can associate with it any more. Working in the radio industry as I do, I see first-hand evidence of this. The station I present on has a fixed number of records which are rotated over and over again because they have been tested for familiarity and popularity on a cross-section of the targeted audience and have gained the highest marks as a result. I would love to be able to play something which is less familiar to a listener because I like it, but that can invariably result in 10,000 radios being immediately re-tuned to another station and the object of what you're trying to do is defeated, putting yourself and your backers in jeopardy. As long as you're doing something which consumers feel safe with, you're always going to have your core audience, and if you happen to employ people who do the safe things well and competently, then that audience will remain and increase as people get used to what your whole purpose is about. The same principle, I believe, applies to WLiiA? and other television shows too, such as soap operas. As long as the most popular participants are employed and are seen to be doing what they do best at a consistently high standard, the audience figures will remain sky-high. TV shows are about audience figures in the end, and if a formula has been struck which keeps those figures at a consistently-high level, then it makes absolute sense to stick with it. Ryan and Colin are established regulars on WLiiA? and their contributions to the show on both sides of the Atlantic have maintained and increased audience figures. Here in the UK, WLiiA? started out with a cult status, with love-or-hate performers like John Sessions provoking argument and comment from the fans but not actively drawing in the masses. As the years and series' progressed and the show learnt from its early drawbacks and changed the formats and contestants accordingly, the audience figures increased and despite its awkward and anti-social time slot, WLiiA? became the most popular long-term project on Channel 4 outside of Brookside and The Big Breakfast. It shed its cult status and became a flagship programme for the station and made stars out of its personalities. Tony Slattery can't walk down a street any more without being mobbed, despite the fact that he hasn't actually done a massive amount of varied TV or film work. Paul Merton is the UK's most recognisable "new" comedian in the country, and from Series Three and for a couple of years hence, Mike McShane was an absolute star in this country. These guys and others have gone on to worldwide fame (and in Paul's case, fortune) from their exploits on the show yet the programme's status meant that when asked what certain people like Paul, Tony and Mike are famous for, the majority will still claim it is WLiiA? that they first think of. This happened because of consistency in the scheduling of the programme and the appearances of the contestants. Once the mainstream, flagship element of the programme had hit home, they needed to keep that at all costs, because Channel 4 is very much that - the fourth channel in terms of recognition, age and audience share - so any alterations to the programme needed to be subtle. Notice that when Ryan started appearing regularly, he still had the insurance of Tony, Mike and Josie around him a lot, so that people could achieve two things by tuning in - watch the contestants whom are established and popular, and introduce a new face gradually who will become one of those established contestants in a year or two. That's exactly what happened. As Ryan became one of those instantly recognisable faces, they then paired him with Colin on a frequent basis and the obvious quality of their improvisation took over. It was a very clever but when you think about it logically, a very simple manoeuvre. Suddenly there was no more Paul, less Josie and little of Mike but Ryan and Colin, with Greg as back-up, became the faces of the show. As their familiarity increased, so did the viewers' recognition of their own individual strengths and who worked best with them. Colin hasn't appeared on a single episode of WLiiA? without Ryan alongside him since his one-off debut in series three. So get Ryan and you get Colin, get both of them and you get laughs. The flagship element of the show therefore meant you needed both to be on top form. If WLiiA? had sunk back to cult status at that stage then the last two UK series would never have been made. It would have been chopped altogether. The best way to ensure that didn't happen was to make sure that the main participants did games which they were comfortable with and could express themselves in - and the best way to do that was to make sure they appeared alongside people they were used to, hence the relentless double-act of Ryan and Colin which has never lost its edge, its humour or its freshness. That is the sign of special talents being marketed well by clever planning. The viewing figures back that up. With regard to Stephen Frost, I beg to differ with Mark's point about "taking the opportunity away from Ryan". Each contestant has their strengths and weaknesses and Stephen's strength is undoubtedly Old Job New Job. I admit that the funniest edition of that game I've ever seen involved Ryan as the dentist who used to be a mechanic - "he's got a huge cavity here!" - but scrolling through the rest of those rounds, I would put Stephen's performances ahead of every other example of Ryan's. That's just an opinion, obviously and many would disagree with me on it. But contestants need to work to their strengths and this game is undoubtedly Stephen's main strength. It comes back to the question of his comfort alongside an American cast, because I'm sure that he gets a sense of being an outcast when appearing with Ryan, Colin and either Brad or Greg, and finds it difficult to relax as a result. This is not his fault, but I feel it is the fault of the planners who have made Stephen a victim of their desire to project Ryan and Colin as regulars. My belief that Ryan doesn't rate Stephen and rarely enjoys performing with him also doesn't help, and Stephen's performances with Americans, while adequate as a whole with some good highlights, aren't a patch on his early days alongside Tony, Jim and Steve. Notice in later editions how well he performed with Caroline, on the rare occasions they were allowed to do so without Ryan or Colin on the scene. Colin isn't a problem for Stephen - he laughs with Stephen and seems to encourage him far more than Ryan ever has. If I am correct, then Ryan is entitled to his opinion and he shouldn't curtail his own abilities to make someone else feel better about their own, but I do feel he could give Stephen more leeway in games when they are together. But in Old Job New Job, Stephen is and has always been absolutely outstanding. In individual games as well, such as Hats or World's Worst, he also is in his element, as he is working for himself and can concentrate purely on what he wants and not what the Americans expect of him. The examples of things which went wrong quoted by Mark were funny moments. There's no doubt about that and I'll never forget Tony's obscene-ridden outburst at Clive which Mark so fondly recollects. But to show more games in which this happens, I feel, would be foolhardy. This show is about a great skill which comedians and actors en masse do not have - the ability to be funny and clever and imaginative on demand. Certain games will always create bloopers and isolated instances of fun have grown as a result - Tony is more fun as a party host when he hasn't got a clue what a quirk is than when he guesses them straightaway, but bear in mind that great games of Party Quirks can also be created from correct guessing (Tony with Steve as Beethoven, Jim as Madly In Love With The Carpet and Mike as Confederate Soldier leaps to mind) and the game is about the ability of the guests to depict the quirks accurately, intelligently and humorously more than it is about the ability of the host to guess them. If that idea is followed, which invariably it is depending on the host, then there is less scope for outbursts or "things going wrong" but the humour element is not lost as a result. I get more satisfaction from watching brilliant improvisation in any game which makes me laugh and marvel at the contestants than I do from bits which go wrong. And back to the original argument, the show is popular because of the skill of the contributors when things go well, more than their reactions when things take a dive. By all means do some more mix and match, which as Mark says, can end up on the cutting-room floor if they don't work, but if the regular games which improvisers play consistently well are reduced as result, then I think the show would go down a very rocky path which could lead to its doom. Audiences want to be comfortable with what they're watching - that is backed up by figures to all TV programmes and sweeping changes for changes's sake could prove mightily perilous for the show's whole status and well-being. I personally could watch Ryan and Colin perform the same games together until my television blows up! Matt ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Variety or no variety That is the question. Wednesday, 18-Aug-1999 19:25:44 209.215.104.239 writes: Well, Certainly this can be argued both ways. Personally, I think that it is not the performers preference to focus on their strengths only because they can be cruel to one another when they get the chance to assign a character to another during the course of improv. Take for instance, Superheros, (I think it was) Jane Brooker who made Ryan recite a poem. Then again Ryan asked Mike to recite one also (freeform Horse on the Roof) Then there is Wayne and Brad singing whatever comes to the minds of Ryan and Colin. Then there are the Audience suggestions, So WL only comes up with the scenes anyway, right? At the beginning of a taping, while you're waiting for it to begin, you're filling out suggestions for Party Quirks or Scenes from a Hat and stuff like that. Surely WL picks which suggestions go to which player based on their personal talent. I thought Rory did an excellent job coming to the party as Tony (so good in fact that Tony knew right away) but Ryan wouldn't have done as good a job on that particular one. He was great made of springs and as a fireworks display. On the other hand, I absolutely love it when they make mistakes and crack up at themselves. When Ryan said,"not even close, is it?" referring to his (John Wayne??) impression and Greg said it's in the ballpark. Also, more recently, when Colin was doing Scooby Doo and he looked at Ryan and they shared a smile. I loved it when Ryan cracked up in Dead Bodies. Well, I guess that's enough of my ramblings. Take care, now Bye bye then. Susan ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved. [Inside The Web] [Image] [Get FREE Message Board] [Image] Whose Board is it Anyway? Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show Thursday, 19-Aug-1999 15:55:40 12.76.124.87 writes: Most of these come from watching DLiiA?... 1. Greg being one of the announcers in Greatest Hits 2. Ryan NOT being in a game of Film, Theater, and Television Styles 3. NOT having three singing games in one episode 4. Playing Song Styles where the audience names an object and a general singing style (e.g. jazz, opera, country) 5. Playing Psychiatrist/Bartender/Prison Visitor 6. Playing Stand, Sit, Lie Down instead of Stand, Sit, Bend Okay, admittedly, 5 and 6 are just things I'd like to see that are not really related to the topic at hand. Another point: You will never see Colin, Ryan, or Greg playing Song Styles or the singing side of Greatest Hits. Why? Because they can't do it well and therefore they wouldn't want to even if you asked them. As I have stated before, half of those games is improvising the correct notes to sing while you're improvising the lyrics. There is a distinct difference between improvising a Hoedown, where the tune you should sing is well-known, and being told to create an original B-52's sound-alike song. Let's lay off the "I want to see someone other than Wayne or Brad sing" comments because it ain't gonna happen. There's a line between variety to make the show more interesting and variety for variety's sake. Scott R. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Message thread: Mark: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:23:34) Molly: Even though I like him, but wasn't John Sessions snobbish and a smarmy git anyway? (and this is coming from someone who likes him) (n/t) (16-Aug-1999 23:29:02) Matt: John Sessions is an actor ahead of a comedian, and a fine actor at that. The problem was that his intense acting overpowered the comedy element of the show, resulting in the smarty-pants and pompous-twit comments which he has suffered. As himself, he is very down to earth, likeable and ordinary. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:54:28) Sharilyn: Re: Hoist on their own...? (16-Aug-1999 23:57:37) Jenna: IMHO..... (17-Aug-1999 02:35:07) Matt: Maybe the contestants' opinions and fears come into this... (17-Aug-1999 10:36:49) Sharilyn: Wow...you've thought about this before, haven't you? =) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 13:14:30) Matt: Yeah - mainly because I squirm when I see Ryan and Steve perform together, for reasons stated previously. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 14:28:02) Jules: *applause* very compelling argument, Matt. (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 15:51:46) Matt: One tries one's best. Thanks Jules! :) (n/t) (17-Aug-1999 21:41:49) Evan aka Brem: Wow, Matt... Great way of thinking about it... Here are my own two cents (or in Canada, three cents) (17-Aug-1999 18:44:54) Mark: Playing Devil's Advocate... :) (17-Aug-1999 20:42:35) Mark: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 01:11:56) Matt: Re: Just a little bit of advocation more... (18-Aug-1999 12:10:30) Susan: Variety or no variety That is the question. (18-Aug-1999 19:25:44) Scott R.: Scott's list of things that can be varied and would not hurt the audience of the show (19-Aug-1999 15:55:40) Evan aka Brem: Righto, Scott... I agree. What some people don't realize is that hoedowning is a different part of the brain than Song Styles (I think)... but Bar Scene would be awesome to watch with DL! (n/t) (20-Aug-1999 13:52:53) Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Prev Page Next Page Now viewing page 3 of 3 (17-Aug-1999 16:42:03 to 14-Aug-1999 13:37:52) [Image] Message subject: Name: (optional) Email address: (optional) Type your message here: [Get them to Buy It!] ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Back to main board ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Copyright © Looksmart, Ltd., 1997-1999 All rights reserved.